Russia can stop this at any time by surrendering.
They don’t need to surrender. just retreat back to the previously agreed international border.
(that is/was Russia’s “ultimatum” to the Ukrainians, so I said that to point out some delicious irony)
Ukraine showed us how strong they are and how much of a paper tiger Russia is.
it has showed us the propaganda working its formulas. i reckon russia claims the same kind of stats to their own people, no?
It’s hard to lie about the line at the gas station.
Not so much, no. Russian media is more concerned with identity politics–discussing the ‘fascism’ of Ukraine, discussing recruitment of (Ukrainian) troops, the difficulties of ‘liberating’ a country, etc.
Except. Ukraine is still there. Fighting. And Russia … Not winning.
That alone shows at least: that either Ukraine is much more powerfull then anyone thought, or that Russia is much weaker then anyone thought.
Probably a little of both.
i mean how do we truly know russia is not winning? i hope for that but…
So, let’s say, hypothetically, Russia has a master plan behind all this - that being the loser is somehow winning them something elsewhere. What would that be? Do they intend to look weak in order to unleash their full potential somewhere else and never intended to take Ukraine at all?
I highly doubt that.
“hypothetically” is exactly how propaganda works
Do you think, maybe, the outlet has a slight bias here? Would you happen to have any other article with corroborating information?
The article points towards an “analyst” on telegram, but he’s just posting numbers without any insight into methodology or where he gets them from beyond being told the numbers.
Of course it has a bias and deserves to be taken with a grain of NaCl. But it helps explain the increasing rates of successful Ukrainian deep strikes and the summer mid range strikes on the Russian logistics network in support of Operation Vivaldi and the isolation of the Crimean peninsula
As I wrote: I take issue with the fact there is nothing backing the numbers. What is the methodology for knowing the successful strikes? Another user said its just the numbers from the Ukrainian government, which seems incredibly naive.
Everything has bias
Could you be more specific with the data you take issue with? The Ukrainian Ministry of Defense has provided the destruction tally, which is good enough for our purposes here.
Do you think air defense technology is easily replaceable by a country that can barely produce 90nm chips (current is down to ~3nm)?
I am the first person to expect relatively good quality reporting/sources, but I don’t see any issues with the statements made in the article.
hot take: trusting a gov to provide war stats is silly. govs have got a documented history of fucking stats or downright lying.
It’s not so much ‘trust’ as ‘acceptance’ that they are the best source available keeping realtime track of, and reporting, what they are doing. The MOD reports are understood to be the upper bound of what actually happened, not the gospel truth. Nobody will have even remotely accurate numbers until years after russia has withdrawn and the war is over, Fog of War being what it is.
Until then, saying “I don’t trust these numbers” is noise. We work within the limitations of what is available. As such, the trend of an increase in reported numbers is itself a noteworthy change and supports the articles message regardless of whether it is only 75 or actually 77.
i can see that. sure. fair. but knowing that we wont know real numbers puts a clamp if distrust on all of them, to me i suppose.
knowing now that the US lied about the gulf of tonkin, back then, doesnt help me trust what they say now. they also lied about the casualty numbers and operations. (in vietnam)
anyway i appreciate the actual reply. my rambling is irrelevant. thanks!
Wondering how many are left and how many they can make.
Estimates vary wildly but anywhere from 200-800. And production estimates vary as well from 5-60/month. So 70 is a significant number.
Yeah… and i imagine that they lose more as they can’t provide mutual overlapping cpverage.
they’re hideously expensive AND ridiculously complex… but even worse, a tremendous amount of electronics that can’t be fabricated in russia are involved. so as far as production is concerned - they can’t make many, it’ll take a long time, and it’ll rely on evading western sanctions.
thats why putin has been desperately trying to make trump and other EU members lift as many sanctions as possible.
I guess it’s soon time for Europe to invade Russia
Why? Nobody wants that garbage.
Russians genuinely believe Europe is invading any time now.
eh… look, there are the putin-forever types, like maga, but I don’t think they represent the majority.
I think the majority is just trying to live through these times and not run afoul of the oligarchs busy running the country into the ground. if they had half a fuckin brain they’d be lighting their own country alight, but that’s another convo.
Kaliningrad must go independent, we need more Baltic states.
I could totally see the independent city state of St Petersburg.
I would rather see a Estonian-Finnish border on Neva. Free cities don’t last.
ehhh, it’s filled with Russians. Do they even want to be independent?
Guess what!? Invad them and do immediatly a referendum of inependence with guns pointed at their heads.
What somebody did this twice before? Must be some kind of mad genius
